[Advaita-l] Physical death of the Jnani and related issues

[Bhaskar YR]

sAshtAnga praNAms Sri Vidya prabhuji
Hare Krishna

I know we have done enough 'charvita charvaNa' of this issue somany times 
earlier...but it is as fresh as ever in my mind :-))  Hence my 
observations below :

Sri Vidya prabhuji :

It seems that according to you and some others, all the teaching by any
jnAnI (which is part of the things that he or she says or does) in history 
is
nothing more than the fanciful imagination of the ajnAnI-s around him or 
her.
This would be as true for Sankara himself as for anybody else. So this 
means
that all the bhAshyas and other texts in our tradition are nothing more 
than false
attributions of a long lineage of ajnAnI-s to someone whom these ajnAnI-s
consider to be a jnAnI. 

bhaskar :

But dont you think shankara himself says all the shAstra & vaidika & 
loukika vyavahAra are due to mutual superimposition & it is nothing but 
avidyA??  He stresses here even 'mOksha' also...From the absolute point of 
view, yes, our identification with ajnAni's BMI, and jnAni's teaching to 
us to get rid of this false identification, shAstra vAkya in this regard, 
AchAryOpadesha, antya pramANa status of shAstra-s, our socalled 
attainment/achievement of Atma/brahma jnAna  everything is 'kevala 
avidyAkruta' only....(sarvANi cha shAstrANi vidhi pratishedha 
mOkshAparANi...shankara in adhyAsa bhAshya)..Yes, we ajnAni-s do need the 
shAstra, Acharya, AchAryOpadesha, mOksha etc. but for a jnAni whose karma 
has been burnt away in jnAnAgni, whose false identity with upAdhi-s 
(BMI)completely erased by this non-dual jnAna, does not see the duality of 
jnAni-ajnAni, pramAtru-prameya-pramANa, jnAtru-jneya-jnAna triputi 
vyavahAra.  Apte cha nAnAtvapratyupasthApikAyA avidyAyA nivruttatvAt , iha 
brahmaNi nAnA nAsti kiMchana aNumAtramapi...firmly insists bhagavatpAda 
elsewhere...So, I dont think avidyAkruta vyavahAra bedha is not a new idea 
in advaita vedAnta...Ofcourse, I know you would agree with me that logic 
(tarka) has its own limitation when it comes to advaita vedAnta siddhAnta 
nirNaya..

Sri Vidya prabhuji : 

For that matter, how does anyone know that someone is a jnAnI? I can speak
for myself and accept that I am an ajnAnI, because I identify myself with 
all
sorts of things in my life. How do I know that Ramana Maharishi or 
somebody
else is a jnAnI? Ultimately, according to your line of reasoning, even the 
label
"jnAnI" can be nothing more than a fanciful attribution by an affirmed 
ajnAnI
on to someone else, is it not?!!

bhaskar :

I dont say identification & calling one as a jnAni with one particular set 
of  BMI by an ajnAni is a fanciful attribution, it is his (ajnAni's) 
respectful regard to the one personality which he adores & worships with 
shraddha & bhakti...That is the reason why jnAni & his identification in 
this world is quite unique & a subjective choice!!  For us ramaNa, 
rAmakrishna, shankara, Acharya-s & jagadguru-s in advaita lineage are all 
jnAni-s & daivajna-s but it is a fact that we have to accept that  it is 
mere shradha & bhakti of us who have undoubted faith in these 
personalities..and it is noway an universal acceptance to make these noble 
personalities as 'adviteeya jnAni-s' in the eyes of ONE and ALL.. 

Kindly pardon me prabhuji if I am unnecessarily argumentative here..

Your Humble servant
Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
bhaskar