bliss

[Chelluri Nageswar Rao]

                                                     Om Sri Matrenamah

Namaste:

I assume most read 1. Biography of Yogi   2. Muktananda and 3. Milarepa

Sri kstuart  Hindu concept of Satchidananda is a lot easier to comrehend than
the concept of Void.   Ananda (Bliss ) is the nature of THAT.   Bliss is
defined in the dictionary as "Supreme Happiness"    It is my understanding
that "THAT" has no attributes.  It is neither bliss nor sad ...  Since there
is no other word to say I think IT is Nothing.   It is difficult to
comprehend "Nothing"  I believe that exactly what it is.

The 3 books mentioned are different but their goal seems to be the same.

Now the question is if one realizes IT why would not stay with it instead of
coming beack to illusion.

I will bring the above 3 works at a later time for discussion.  Like Sri
ksturat said it is good to read different philosphies.

Regards

                                                                     Nageswar

>From  Tue Oct  1 03:10:21 1996
Message-Id: <TUE.1.OCT.1996.031021.GMT.>
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 03:10:21 GMT
Reply-To: kstuart at mail.telis.org
To: "Advaita (non-duality) with reverence" <ADVAITA-L at TAMU.EDU>
From: Ken Stuart <kstuart at MAIL.TELIS.ORG>
Subject: Re: bliss
Comments: To: "Advaita (non-duality) with reverence" <ADVAITA-L at TAMU.EDU>
In-Reply-To: <960930223717_297706961 at emout05.mail.aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hello,

On Mon, 30 Sep 1996 22:37:18 -0400, Chelluri Nageswar Rao
<Chelluri at aol.com> wrote:

>                                                     Om Sri Matrenamah
>
>Namaste:
>
>I assume most read 1. Biography of Yogi   2. Muktananda and 3. Milarepa

Yes, if you mean "Autobiography of a Yogi" by Yogananda, "Play Of
Consciousness" the autobiography of Muktananda, and "The Life of
Milarepa" which I seem to remember is by T. Lobsang Rampa.

>Sri kstuart  Hindu concept of Satchidananda is a lot easier to comrehend than
>the concept of Void.   Ananda (Bliss ) is the nature of THAT.   Bliss is
>defined in the dictionary as "Supreme Happiness"    It is my understanding
>that "THAT" has no attributes.  It is neither bliss nor sad ...

First off, "Supreme Happiness" would seem to mean a different thing
than just "happiness", ie the happiness that is the opposite of
sadness.  Bliss is not the opposite of anything, it can't be because
it exists everywhere all the time.   We just let things get in the way
of experiencing this bliss.

Second, to say "THAT" has no attributes is not true, in fact
Satchidanda is a description of its attributes, ie existence,
consciousness, bliss.   Some might say that "attributes" as a plural
word is incorrect, since all three are the same, ie
existence=consciousness=bliss.

>The 3 books mentioned are different but their goal seems to be the same.

Yes, in fact, at various times in my life, I've been a member of the
organizations started by each of those three masters.

>>Now the question is if one realizes IT why would not stay with it instead of
>coming beack to illusion.

I'm not sure whether you mean intentionally coming back, or being
drawn back in spite of one's intentions.

Saints come back to the physical plane to help the rest of us.   While
they do this, they remain outside of the sway of illusion.

Someone who is drawn back unintentionally is not "realized", ie
self-realized or enlightened.   People are drawn back from experiences
of samadhi either by samskaras, ie habitual tendencies of the mind
(that must be removed by spirtual practice), or by karma.


Cheers,

Ken                         <*>
kstuart at mail.telis.org
>From ADVAITA-L at TAMU.EDU Tue Oct  1 14:46:20 1996
Message-Id: <TUE.1.OCT.1996.144620.0230.ADVAITAL at TAMU.EDU>
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 14:46:20 -0230
Reply-To: "Advaita (non-duality) with reverence" <ADVAITA-L at TAMU.EDU>
To: "Advaita (non-duality) with reverence" <ADVAITA-L at TAMU.EDU>
From: Gummuluru Murthy <gmurthy at MORGAN.UCS.MUN.CA>
Subject: mind, the mischief-maker (was Re: LIFE)
Comments: To: "Advaita (non-duality) with reverence" <ADVAITA-L at TAMU.EDU>
Comments: cc: Multiple recipients of list ADVAITA-L <ADVAITA-L at TAMU.EDU>
In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.16.19960930153936.08e7e14c at mail.jetlink.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Mon, 30 Sep 1996, Charles A. Hillig wrote:

> >Why ten minute fuse of contemplation ? My preference is not to give even
> >one minute for the explosion to take place so that Silence and Quietness
> >is unchained and liberated.
>
> The Silence is NOT  "chained."  IT is ever present.
>
Yes, the silence is ever present. I agree. But, why is silence not
accessible to us then ? We all have a sense for the beauty of silence
and look forward to be in its noble presence. But we are not able to do
it. Why ? I contend the enemy is the mind, which would not let us go into
the company of silence. That is why, my feeling is that the mind is the
biggest source of the problem.

> >Ten minutes is too long a time for the mind
> >to work its by now well-known web of illusion.
> >
> >The biggest source of all problems we encounter is the Mind, the
> >uncontrolled and which roams as it wishes without any leash.
>
> The biggest so-called problem may be to get past the delusion that  there IS
> a "separate Mind" that's creating all of this mischief.
>
I would be grateful if you expand on this. You seem to be saying that
there is no problem at all and the only so-called problem is the delusion
that there is a problem. Am I reading you right ?

I consider the mind to be an obstacle because of its wandering nature.

While the Atman is ever free and all-encompassing, still the body and the
mind give us the individuality that we are forced to accept for the life
of the body. It is of paramount importance that the body and the mind
are controlled by the Atman so that when we speak, it is the Atman that
speaks and when we interact with the rest of the world, the body and the
mind obey the commands of the Atman. The body lives in this unreal world
and the mind which is the receptacle of the perceptions of the sense-
organs reacts to this unral world. The recognition is made of the
unreality of the body and the thoughts that the sense organs bring (the
mind). Body is a corpse and there is no problem with that. Mind is a
stream of thoughts that pass through and the unreality of the thoughts
are also recognized. Further, mind is disciplined (or controlled by the
Atman or the Self) to the extent that only noble thoughts pass through.
Still however, in order for the veil of ignorance to be removed fully,
we need to be in a thoughtless state. That is where I see the mind as the
mischief-maker.

> >Mindworks Ltd (with its Managing Director, the maaya) is a factory which
> >creates all sorts of unnecessary and banned (to an advaitin) substances.
> >I will even add, it creates only unrequired gadgets and puts hindrance
> >at every step of the way.
> >
> >The sooner we get rid of this factory, the closer we are to remove the
> >veil of ignorance.
> >
> >Regards
> >Gummuluru Murthy
> >
>
> The "factory" will continue to, seemingly, "do" whatever IT, seemingly,
 "does."
> Your discovery that the "lake" that you see in the desert is really only a
> mirage is NOT going to make this "lake" disappear.   But, after you realize
> that it's not real, you won't be running after it as before.  You may not
> really, seemingly, awaken FROM the illusion as much as TO the illusion.
>
Following Sri egodust's very appropriate (in my view) description of the
functions of the factory Mindworks Ltd (with maaya as the Managing
Director), in order for us to be in a thoughtless state (i.e. in the
company of silence), the only way to do this is to close the factory.
We can get the factory produce more useful gadgets but as long as the
owner/Managing Director is maaya, that cannot be accomplished. Hence,
the solution suggested by Sri egodust, with which I concur.


>      Spiritual "progress" is impossible.  There's nothing that  "you" can
> "do" to, seemingly, get to a place where you already exist as the Absolute
> SELF.   Believing that there is, however, provides the momentum for you to
> go out looking for  "The Truth."   However, your very act of seeking only
> validates your delusion that you are, quintessentially, different from what
> it is that you are seeking.
>
>      Let go of struggle, do-ership and attainment.  Let go of it all!
>
>           (and then let go of "letting go.")   Only the SELF is present.
>
Certainly, we are not running after the lake in a desert anymore. We do
not even see the lake. We are not seeking anything. What all is wanted
is to be in the company of silence. It is recognized it is within us
but is still elusive.

If mind is not the one that is making it difficult, I (the worldly) would
like to know what is.

>                          With Blessings,
>                                           Chuck Hillig
>

Regards
Gummuluru Murthy
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Sarvaa gamaanaa maachaarah prathamam parikalpathe !
                                Sage Vyaasa in Maha Bhaaratha
For all (incoming) knowledge, discipline is the most fundamental
--------------------------------------------------------------------