[Advaita-l] Vaadiraaja Teertha's Yuktimallika - Advaita Criticism - Slokas 1-511 to 1-524

[Venkatesh Murthy]

Namaste

Thanking all for giving nice responses. We can give one example using
animals because Vadiraja also used two fighting cows example. I made this
example to convince him.

You are in a dream. You are a hunter living in a forest and there is a good
hunting dog with you. That dog is giving you expert guidance with its
smelling ability to detect animals scent and take you near animals like
rabbits and deer. Then you shoot those animals with your gun and the
hunting dog will bring the dead animal to you. You are living your life
happily with your family and the dog but some other hunters warn you there
is a fierce lion in the forest and be careful not to go near it. But you
want to show your bravery and you want to shoot that Lion.

You are going on a hunt one day with your dog very deep in the forest. You
have come very deep and you want find and shoot the Lion. Your dog is
guiding you to the Lion. Suddenly you are face to face with the lion
standing in your way. In the fear you have dropped the gun from your hand
to the ground. That lion opens its mouth showing very sharp teeth and
pounces on you. You become very scared and wake up from the dream crying
with fear.

If you now think what happened the hunting dog is like the Bheda Sruti. It
is helping you in the dream world and keeping you happy. The Lion is like
the Abheda Sruti and has awakened you. But when Lion is there the Dog is
also there. When Lion is not there the Dog also is not there. In waking
condition Lion and Dog both are not there. Therefore we cannot say Dog is
false and Lion is true. Both are false. We cannot say Dog is not helping
you and only Lion is useful. Each animal is useful for something. The Dog
helped you in the dream but the Lion helped to come out of the dream.

On Fri, Jun 23, 2017 at 4:21 PM, Bhaskar YR via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> praNAms Sri Subbu prabhuji
> Hare Krishna
>
> I am not able to read your Sanskrit bhAshya vAkya but if you are quoting
> about shankAvishA and resultant mrutyu, and  svapna is asatya svapnAnubhava
> is satya  etc. if I remember right I have quoted this along with kArikA
> bhAshya where bhAshyakAra clarifies why shruti rejects all upAya-s  which
> try to denote Atman by saying  neti neti and  how mere  lines would give us
> the correct knowledge of number though lines are not directly related to
> no. But my good dvaita prabhuji continued his objection on these quotes
> also…and said clarification of siddhAnti to the pUrvapaxi is still open for
> further deliberation.  As I said before I don’t remember all those
> objections now.
>
> Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
> bhaskar
>
> From: V Subrahmanian [mailto:v.subrahmanian at gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, June 23, 2017 3:49 PM
> To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta <advaita-l at lists.advaita-
> vedanta.org>
> Cc: Bhaskar YR <bhaskar.yr at in.abb.com>; Anand Hudli <
> anandhudli at hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Vaadiraaja Teertha's Yuktimallika - Advaita
> Criticism - Slokas 1-511 to 1-524
>
> Dear Bhaskar ji,
>
> Your nicely articulated question has been answered by Shankara in the
> ārambhaṇādhikaraṇa bhashya: tadanyatvammm. BSB 2.1.14:
>
>  तस्मात्प्राग्ब्रह्मात्मताप्रतिबोधादुपपन्नः सर्वो लौकिको वैदिकश्च
> व्यवहारः — यथा सुप्तस्य प्राकृतस्य जनस्य स्वप्ने उच्चावचान्भावान्पश्यतो
> निश्चितमेव प्रत्यक्षाभिमतं विज्ञानं भवति प्राक्प्रबोधात् , न च
> प्रत्यक्षाभासाभिप्रायस्तत्काले भवति, तद्वत् । कथं त्वसत्येन वेदान्तवाक्येन
> सत्यस्य ब्रह्मात्मत्वस्य प्रतिपत्तिरुपपद्येत ? न हि रज्जुसर्पेण दष्टो
> म्रियते ; नापि मृगतृष्णिकाम्भसा पानावगाहनादिप्रयोजनं क्रियत इति । नैष दोषः,
> शङ्काविषादिनिमित्तमरणादिकार्योपलब्धेः, स्वप्नदर्शनावस्थस्य च
> सर्पदंशनोदकस्नानादिकार्यदर्शनात् । तत्कार्यमप्यनृतमेवेति चेद्ब्रूयात् ,
> अत्र ब्रूमः — यद्यपि स्वप्नदर्शनावस्थस्य सर्पदंशनोदकस्नानादिकार्यमनृतम् ,
> तथापि तदवगतिः सत्यमेव फलम् , प्रतिबुद्धस्याप्यबाध्यमानत्वात् ; न हि
> स्वप्नादुत्थितः स्वप्नदृष्टं सर्पदंशनोदकस्नानादिकार्यं मिथ्येति
> मन्यमानस्तदवगतिमपि मिथ्येति मन्यते कश्चित् ।
>
> Someone may kindly give a gist of the above so that in case Sri Bhaskar ji
> is not able to view the above lines in his system, it will help him.
>
> Thanks and regards
> subbu
>
> On Fri, Jun 23, 2017 at 3:25 PM, Bhaskar YR via Advaita-l <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org<mailto:advaita-l@
> lists.advaita-vedanta.org>> wrote:
> 2) both abheda and bheda shrutis are atattvAvedaka.
>
> praNAms Sri Anand Hudli prabhuji
> Hare Krishna
>
> When there was a discussion about shAstra prAmANya ( I don’t remember in
> which group), when I said,  bandha mOksha, shAstra all are in the realm of
> avidyA kshetra (vide adhyAsa bhAshya) someone asked me, OK after the dawn
> of knowledge through shAstra vAkya you are going to say shAstra is also in
> the avidyA kshetra, it is no more pramANa and pramANa, prameya, pramAtru
> all are kevala avidyA vyavahAra so no reality in it. So after the dawn of
> socalled knowledge you have you are sure that your approach towards pramANa
> is avidyAtmaka.    If that is the case how can you be sure that the
> socalled knowledge what you get from the shAstra is vidyA when shruti
> itself is in avidyA kshetra ??  Since the person (pramAtru) who approach
> the shruti is avidyAvanta, the pramANa the shruti is again in the realm of
> this avidyA kshetra  you boldly declaring that what you got (prama)  from
> this avidyA pramAna  which has been approached by avidyAvanta pramAtru is
> ultimate satya and jnana!!  How can you be sure about your jnana when you
> are claiming that shAstra is itself not directly teaching the brahman as
> that and this ?? In short,  How can a atattvAvedaka vAkya can fetch you the
> knowledge of tattva??  And again the karma, vidhi and phala which are part
> and parcel of karma kAnda of veda you are  pushing it aside as avidyaka (if
> not outrightly rejecting it)  and holding the other portion (jnana kAnda)
> of same veda and claiming that knowledge obtaining from that is
> unsublatable knowledge...It clearly shows your dubious approach towards
> veda as pramANa.  He asked somany questions like this, I just remembered
> this objectione when I read the shruti pramANa is in avidyAkshetra but
> shruti knowledge is ultimate and other shruti / veda knowledge pertaining
> to karma kAnda  is dvaita and hence avidyAtmaka.
>
> And frankly I don’t know what I had replied to him since it was almost a
> decade ago :-)
>
> Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
> bhaskar
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-- 
Regards

-Venkatesh