[Advaita-l] Shaivism and Vedic Hinduism

[Sriram Sankaranarayanan]

Dear Sri Subrahmanian ji,

I have heard (perhaps incorrectly), that unlike Shankara, Ramanuja's
ideology was ambiguous to his own followers, leading into the
vadagalai/thenkalai division, each claiming that it is their version of
philosophy that Ramanuja propounded. One version (north-istic or vadagalai)
believes in a strict caste based hierarchy while the other (south-istic or
Thenkalai) doesn't.  A google search returned me this link, which has the
following

*16. Caste and Prapanna, how related?*
*N. Say that a Prapanna, but who is of an inferior caste, is deserving of
only so much respect as may be displayed by the tongue.*
*S. Say that no such limitations can be tolerated. A Prapanna must be
regarded completely as a Prapanna, irrespective of caste, creed, or colour.
No inequality begat by caste or other such formalities and conventions
ought to separate the godly from the godly.*

The above is one of the many differences between the two sects. The source
link is here -
https://sreevaishnavam.wordpress.com/2012/11/29/vadakalai-thenkalai-doctrinal-differences/
. I am not sure about the authenticity of this source though.

Best,
Sriram


Hamsah Soham

On Thu, Jan 5, 2017 at 1:22 PM, V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> Here is an excerpt from a Ramanuja discussion group:
>
> http://www.ramanuja.org/sv/bhakti/archives/aug95/0007.html
>
> //NO CASTE EXCLUSIVITY AMONG VAISHNAVAS
>
> Sri Vaishnavas can come from any caste (e.g) Alvars. Kulasekara was a
> Kshatruiya. Thirumangai was also a Kshatriya by birth. Nammalwar was not a
> Brahmin. Thirumazhisai Alwar was a Siva Worshipper  earlier.
> Thondaradipodi,
> Periyalwar were Brahmins. The common things that tie them are the
> observance of
> the sacraments of Vaishnavism and the observance of the religious duties of
> Vaishnavas.DR.S.M.S.Chari"s well-written book "Vaishnavism, Its philosophy,
> theology and religious discipline" will be very helpful to you to gain a
> perspective on the details of Vaishnavism. Chapters 8 and 13 are brilliant
> summaries of  two important doctrines of Vaishnavism. Chapter 8 deals with
> Vishnu and Goddess Sri. Chapter 13 deals with the important subject of
> Prapatti.//
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017 at 11:05 PM, Venkatesh Murthy via Advaita-l <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
> > Namaste
> >
> > How is it possible to say Shaivism is different from Brahminical
> > religion when Satarudriya is from Vedas only? It is a useless
> > argument.
> >
> > As a matter of fact in Gujarat and other places Vaishnavas are not
> > considered Brahmins. Only Shiva worshippers are Brahmins. Well known
> > fact is Brahmins must worship Siva and Kshatriyas Vishnu. Vaishyas are
> > Devi Upasakas and Sudras have to worship Ganesha.
> >
> > In Pooja and other matters Vaidika and Agama methods are combined.
> > This is the way it is today. Nobody in Brahmin tradition is doing pure
> > 100% Vaidika or 100% Agama worship. Non Brahmins must not do Vaidika
> > worship but always Agama or Puranokta worship only. Ladies also can do
> > Puranokta worship with Pauranika Mantras. They should not say Gayatri
> > Mantras and Vedic Mantras like some ladies are doing. It is wrong.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jan 4, 2017 at 11:09 PM, Santosh Rao via Advaita-l
> > <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> > > Namaskara,
> > >
> > > Is there a difference between "vaidika dharma" and the Shaiva sects?
> > >
> > > From some reading it seems the prevalent academic opinion is that
> > Shaivism
> > > and Shiva worship in general was largely separate from the Brahminical
> > > religion for a large period of history before some coalescing between
> the
> > > two occurred. Also, while Vaishnavism seems to be heavily tied into
> this
> > > "Brahmanism," Shaivism seems to be less so. Is there a reason for this,
> > or
> > > is there a discrepancy between tradition and the academic view?
> > >
> > > Also, how does the Smarta tradition view the Shaiva agamas? Are they
> > > accepted as authoritative at all? Is there a general view of Shaivas
> > > regarding Vedas and Upanishads, Puranas, etc; or does it vary from sect
> > to
> > > sect? Are there any Shaiva sects that could correctly be labelled as
> > > "non-vedic?"
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > Santosh
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> >
> > --
> > Regards
> >
> > -Venkatesh
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