[Advaita-l] How can prANa be Brahman?

[Venkatraghavan S]

Namaste Sujal ji

Thank you for your reply.

I agree with you in that yoga can help attain shama, samAdhAnam etc
required as part of sAdhana catusthTayam in order to purify and focus the
mind to enable it be an efficient receptacle for jnAna. That is it serves a
purpose before jnAna sAdhana.

Yoga also serves a purpose during nidhidhyAsana for those who despite
shravaNam and mananam are beset with viparIta bhAvana (deep set mental
obstacles that prevent one from claiming one's status as Brahman) - that is
despite jnAna arising in their mind, they are unable to reconcile that
jnAna with everyday reality. For such people, nidhidhyAsanam  (yoga-based
vedAnta nidhidhyAsanam)  can be helpful to get rid of notions of viparIta
bhAvana, through a process of mithyAtva nishchaya.

I also agree with you that the attainment of Brahman by jnAna is
essentially prAptasya prApti - it is simply the eradication of ignorance
that I am not Brahman. In fact, I think jnAnam is both necessary and
sufficient for mokshA. That is, 1) only jnAnam can lead to moksha 2)
nothing other than jnAnam is required at all.  This is where I differ from
the various yogic upanishads you quote that cite the requirement for jnAna
and yoga.

By "destruction of mind" I thought you implied a 'physical destruction' of
the mind (if I have misunderstood your views, please clarify. This is
something that I do not consider is necessary - in fact this is
undesirable, without a mind where will jnAna arise? A clear understanding
that the mind, being anAtma, is mithyA is sufficient. That is, use the mind
to claim that I, the witness consciousness am Brahman, while saying that
the mind is mithyA, dependent on me, the witness.

Regards
Venkatraghavan


On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 11:01 AM, Sujal Upadhyay <sujal.u at gmail.com> wrote:

> Namaste Venkatraghvan ji,
>
> Destruction of mind and not 'destruction of mind only through Yogic
> process' is necessary for moksha.
> Here in reply to Krishnamoorthy ji, I explained in brief, but in the
> article, I have explained various ways.
> The thing is that even after kuNDalini is fully activated and reaches
> sahasrAra, the journey is not complete. One has to abide in non-dual
> brahman. It is here that advaita approach is used. Yoga Upanishads say that
> both Yoga and Jnana are necessary for moksha. They sing glory of yoga and
> Jnana.
>
> Brahman can only be realised by Jnana alone as you are already that
> Brahman. So it is called as 'prAptasya prApti' - achieving that which is
> already achieved. Hence it is said, one has to realise oneself as Brahman.
> the process of yoga, helps one concentrate and make one ready from
> BrahmaGYana. No disturbance occurs for the one adept in yoga.
>
> In simple words
> 1. Reach a state very near to yoga.
> 2. with Jnana, realise true nature
>
> In the state of yoga or as nAtha yogis say, samarasya, one experiences 'I
> am one with paramAtmA (Brahman). There is still duality. Hence Jnana is
> necessary to enter into non-dual state. This is my personal understanding.
>
> What pramANa is being used to generate jnAna in the yogic process? None of
>> the six pramANas are being invoked in samAdhi or in the destruction of
>> vAsanAs through the process you describe.
>>
>> In fact if the mind itself is resolved in nirvikalpa samAdhi, there is no
>> pramAta even, so how can jnAna be generated then without a pramAta or a
>> pramANa?
>>
>
> I guess you already got answer. Final emancipation is only by the way of
> Jnana - the advaita way - ajAti vAda. Else only by meditating i.e. making
> an effort, one can realize Brahman. This is not true. We are already
> Brahman. Just be in your natural state.
>
>> So jnAna isn't the cause for abidance in Brahman. How can you agree then
>> that moksha is attained through jnAna  alone?
>>
> Or are you saying that abidance in Brahman is not moksha?
>>
> Abidance in Brahman means nirvikalp samAdhi, not moksha. One still has to
> make an effort to abide in Brahman. In words of Sri Ramana Maharsih, sahaja
> samAdhi i.e. permanent rooting in Brahman, is moksha.
>
> Sri Ramakrishna's guru Totapuri taught advaita to Sri Ramakrishna. Since
> he taught advaita and by his teachings Sri Ramakrishna also entered into
> nirvikalpa samAdhi, hence even Totapuri used to experience this state, but
> after meditation is over, he used to stay in duality. That is why he didnt
> experience Brahman in everything in waking state and got angry when someone
> ignited cigerette (bidi) from dhUni. To abide in your natural state should
> not involve any effort. It is natural to be just you :)
>
>
> ​Hari ​
> OM
>
> Sujal
>