[Advaita-l] [advaitin] Why only jagat is mithya and jeeva is brahman !!??

[Srirudra]

Dears
In the Mandukyopanishad while dealing with the rope snake analogy to explain the world as an illusion only,it is said that a substratum is necessary to create even an illusion.So the rope is necessary to create an illusion of a snake.If there is no rope there can not be an illusion of a snake.So Brahman is the substratum on which Jiva sees the world which is an illusion or simply mithya.It follows that there should be similarity between Brahman and the world.Probably with this in view other schools of thought like Saivism,Sankhyam etc were derived or propagated.Gaudapada Kariga can be taken as a reference.

Further the Upanishad says that the substratum or Brahman is not the cause of the world .Though  Jivas mistake the universe as projected by Brahman,Brahman has no role  in it is the firm contention of the vedantins.
So it is not correct to say there was creation as Brahman desired like that etc are not compatible with the attributes of Brahman.Brahman is poornam.He has no desire to fulfil  and He does not require to play to get Himself engaged in creation to satisfy Him.
This is very difficult to grasp .We are not able to get rid of our amazement on seeing the world outside with Sun Moon and other celestial objects following a pattern in clockwise precision.Plants,animals moving around with their assigned roles.We in our little thinking capacity  come to a conclusion that there should be a single command which makes all these things happen.
Taithriya Upanishad speaks of -for out of fear of Brahman the fire fires ,the Sun shines etc-.
Therefore it is difficult to reconcile an action less Brahman.If the entire thing is an illusion does it mean all human beings are seeing the same illusion?
Probably our understanding of the whole phenomena is deficient and our reasoning faculty is not measuring enough to unravel what is Brahman.
R.Krishnamoorthy.
Sent from my iPad

> On 21-Mar-2016, at 1:29 PM, H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> 
> Sri Venkateswaran Ji and Sri Ravi Kiran Ji,
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Reg the question posed by Sri Venkateswaran Ji
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> << To differentiate between the adhiSTAna (of jagat) and svarUpa (of
>> jIva), I am attempting two analogies as follows.
>> Request the learned members to comment.
>> 
>> 1. Brahman being the adhiSTAna of jagat can be explained by the mirage in
>> the desert, wherein the mirage has nAma-rUpa but ultimately it is bhrama
>> (illusion) with the hot sand being only the adhiSTAna, but not its svarUpa.
>> 
>> 2. The svarUpa of jIva being Brahman can be explained using the
>> gold-ornaments example, wherein when you remove the nAma-rUpa of the
>> ornaments, only the gold (svarUpa) remains.>>,
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> both the illustrations mentioned are together  useful in understanding
>> the statement << Brahma Satyam Jaganmithya >> ( Brahman being the adhiSTAna
>> of jagat) only.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Brahman was एकमेबाद्वितीयम् (ekamebAdvitIyam) in the beginning. This
>> “expands” as jagat. The explanation for this process should also be
>> consistent with other advaitic concepts like सत्कारण सत्कारय वाद
>> (satkAraNa satkAraya vAda ) , cause and effect relation etc. The gold
>> ornaments illustration is helpful in this regard in the following manner.
>> This illustration  could be extended to पंचीकृत पंच भूत (paMchIkRRita
>> paMcha bhUta) transforming into the gross Creation. paMchIkRRita paMcha
>> bhUtas refer to Gold and the gross Creation refer to Ornaments.  It should
>> be noted that both this and the gold ornament illustration involves  विकार
>> (vikAra ) (modification) of the elements involved.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> But the Shruti declares Brahman as निर्विकार(nirvikAra) (not subject to
>> modification). How is this to be adhered to? Here is where the second
>> illustration of mirage water helps. The “modification” of Brahman into
>> पंचीकृत पंच भूत is explained in terms of this illustration. Thus Brahman
>> “expands” into the entire gross Creation without undergoing any change
>> itself.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> This also establishes the mithya character of the gross Creation
>> originating from Satya Brahman.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I have considered only part of jagat in this explanation. It is to be
>> extended to the whole of Creation.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> This is how the two illustrations together are useful in understanding the
>> statement ब्रह्म सत्यम् जगन्मिथ्या (brahma satyam jaganmithyA) ( Brahman
>> being the adhiSTAna of jagat).
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Regards
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