[Advaita-l] A Perspective - 21 cont

[Kuntimaddi Sadananda]

Shree Viswanathji - PraNAms


First thanks for your comments.



Second I would like point out that some of my statements have to be
understood correctly. There is adhikaaritvam for applying the statements for
individual.

The last statement - the key word is ULTIMATELY - that is only after
realization one recognizes that he is ever mukta - all that process of
realization was not necessary - That statement is not for a saadhak who is
longing for realization nor the one who is desiring to act to achieve things
in life.



The story I gave - the fellow whet to his friend house to show of his new
chain in his neck. After chit chatting he returned back home and to his
surprise he did not find his chain in his neck - Thinking that he left that
chain with his friend he ran back four miles to his friend and asked him
whereabouts of the chain. When his friend showed it to him that it is in his
neck only hidden between the folds, he was happy and returned back.



Now the question asked - was that four miles of running necessary to find
the chain?



If we say it was not necessary since the chain was with him all the time,
then it is wrong answer since he was desperately looking for the chain and
going through samsaara with no end in sight.



If we say it was necessary then also the answer is wrong since the chain was
with him all the time and he did not have to run four miles for it.



The correct answer is - He had run four miles to discover that he did not
have to run four miles to discover the chain.



All saadhana are required to discover that all saadhana WERE not required
for realization. Notice the past tense.



Saadhana catuShTayam is required until one realizes that saadhana
chatuShTayam WAS not required for realization one self.



So also - Realization is required to recognize realization WAS not required.




Similarly sanyaasa too. tyaagenaike amRitatvamaanasuH - says scripture.

I was only referring to bhoutika sanyaasa that Bhaskarji asked me. One has
to give all dependence on unnecessary things and environments so that one's
mind is free from indulgence in all worldly affairs - what Swami
Paramarthanandaji calls it as PORT - possessions, Obligations, Relations and
Transactions -  minimization of these to the bare minimum helps in diverting
the mind to higher. In that sense bhoutika sanyaasa is helpful if one can
take it. Otherwise maanasika sanyaasa is a must for withdrawing the mind
from dependence on things other than oneself for one's happiness.



Therefore saadhana is required until one realizes that all that saadhana WAS
not required.


Hope I am clear.
Hari Om!
Sadananda



On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 11:21 AM, Vishy <vishy1962 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Acharya Sadaji
>
>
> Pranams. Recenly I happened to attend 7days lecture of swami Dayananda
> Saraswati
> in Muscat. Your goodself have exactly summarized what swamy said during the
> lectures.
> Thanks a lot.
>
> "Ultimately realization is to realize that I do not have to realize"
>
> I feel thats the ultimate truth and what is said directly in " Ashtawakra
> Geetha' . In that way there cant be anything more hard and direct than AG.
>
> Pranams
> Viswanath
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On Mon, 1/3/10, Kuntimaddi Sadananda <ksadananda108 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> From: Kuntimaddi Sadananda <ksadananda108 at gmail.com>
> Subject: [Advaita-l] A Perspective - 21 cont
> To: advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org
> Date: Monday, 1 March, 2010, 1:50 PM
>
>
>  The next level of understanding comes with jnaana where I understand that
> I
> am not ever a doer to have the result.  Here there is no karma phala tyaaga
> since karma itself does not belong to me. It is clear understanding that I
> am never a doer to begin with. This understanding comes with jnaana where I
> understand that I am akarthaa – in spite of actions being done by the body,
> mind and intellect, BMI. This understanding comes only when I recognize
> that
> they (BMI) are in me and I am not in them. They are part of prakRiti which
> is my lower nature. My true nature is I am pure
> existence-consciousness-limitless. I pervade this entire universe of beings
> and objects in an unmanifested form –
>
> maya tatam idam sarvam jagat avyakta muurtinaa,
>
> mastaani sarva bhuutani na ca aham teshu avasthitaH| says Krishna.
>
> I pervade this entire universe in unmanifested form. In Me only all beings
> are there, but yet I am not in any of them. When jnaani understands that I
> am that – tat tvam asi- any claims that I am doer gets transcended in that
> understanding – He may scream with ecstasy – akartaaham abhoktaaham ahameva
> ahamavyayaH – I am neither doer nor enjoyer, I am that I am eternal and
> inexhaustible.  When that understanding sinks in, I recognize that BMI
> belongs to the prakRiti which is nothing but maayaa only – maayantu
> prakRitim viddhyaat says swetasvatara Up.  I recognize that  I am pure
> saakshii and prakRiti becomes dynamic in my presence and performs an action
> and Sat-chit-ananda that I am is never get affected by the actions or
> inactions of the prakRiti. Krishna says: prakRiti eva ca karmaaNi
> kriyamaanaani sarvaShaH|,
>
> yaH pasyati tat aatmaanam akartaaram sa pasyati||
>
> – All actions are done by prakRiti alone and who ever recognizes that I am
> never a doer – he alone sees the truth. Hence jnaani understands that
> actions do not belong to him but to prakRiti but that prakRiti acts in his
> presence only. He remains akarthaa or non-doer in spite of any action that
> is being done in his presence. Krishna discusses action, inaction and
> unaction exhaustively in Ch. 4 saying that many have misconceptions about
> it.
>
>
>
> With this understanding we can look at the question – what does the sarva
> karma sanyaasa – renunciation of all actions implies. This cannot be done
> by
> giving up the action as Krishna discusses in the 18th Ch. Gita. He starts
> the gitopadesha with the statement that no one can remain even for a second
> without performing an action. If so, how can I give up an action. However
> if
> I understand correctly that I am never an actor in spite of the action that
> is being done at BMI level, then I have – as though – renounced any notion
> that I am actor – that forms the essence of sarva karma sanyaasa – giving
> up
> all the actions without any exception. Hence the statement essentially
> means
> there is no more kartRitva bhaavam, that is the notion that I am doer is
> gone in the awakening of the knowledge that I am pure saakshii swaruupam.
> Clear understanding of this fact is sarva karma sanyaasa. It is essentially
> renouncing the wrong notions that I am doer and therefore I have give up
> the
> doing. If I am never a doer, where is there then to give up. Therefore
> karma
> sanyaasa should imply I am renouncing the notion that I am a doer. That can
> happen only when I understand the fact that I am pure sat-chit-ananda
> swaruupa. Hence Krishna says:
>
> naivakinchit karomiiti yukto manyeta tattavavit|
>
> pasyanshRinvanspRishan jigran ashnan gacchanswapansvasan||
>
> pralayan visRijan gRahanan unmiShannimiShannapi|
>
> indriyanindriyaartheShu vartanta iti dharayan||
>
> All activities are being done by the senses as they are programmed and
> jnaani understands that he is never a doer –Krishna lists all the
> activities
> at BMI level as being performed by the prakRiti itself.
>
>
>
> That understanding is sarva karma sanyaasa – it is not really renouncing
> actions that I never do but renouncing the notion that I am doer. Notions
> will get removed only in the awakening of the knowledge.
>
> --------
>
> Bhaskar :
> *. This is exactly where I requested your thoughts on
> physical saNyAsa prabhuji...As far as karma phala tyAga & inaction in
> action I am in full agreement with your goodself.*
>
> Bhaskarji - PraNAms
>
> As for as physical sanyaasa is concerned, I concur with Swami
> Paramarthanandaji
> talks on Sanyaasa - One may be able to down load that talk.
>
> In essence it is not necessary, but it is helpful.
>
> The true sanyaasa that is required is to give up all the wrong notions
> about
> myself. The rest of it I take as interpretations and one has to interpret
> correctly since the ultimate goal is oneself that is beyond any attachments
> or
> renunciations. NivRitti as saadhana is only to give up unnecessary things
> that
> distract the mind and concentrate on the teaching of the Vedanta. There
> also
> physical sanyaasa can help but it is not necessary. NivRitti as the end
> point
> is what I have written to recognize that I am never a doer in order for me
> to
> give doing. Hope I am clear. When I understand my nature is nitya mukta
> swaruupam - any pravRitti or nivRitti has no meaning.
>
> Ultimately realization is to realize that I do not have to realize. For
> that
> pravRitti and/or nivRitti are needed. Remember that I have to run four
> miles
> to
> find out that I did not have to run that four miles. The point is I have to
> recognize the chain I am looking for is with me all the time. If I can know
> that
> without running - that is better. Other wise I have run and then realize
> the
> I
> did not have to run. Essentially what is needed is saadhana catuShTaya
> sampatti.
>
> Hari Om!
> Sadananda
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