[Advaita-l] APerspective 17-2

[Anbu sivam2]

Dear Sunilji,

How many interpretations are there on Bhagavad Geetha from dwaithic view to
advaithic view and all in-between?

A book is inert though it would help to seek.  But liberation is only
through the Chaithanyam,  the personal Guru.

Regards,
Anbu

On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 11:21 AM, Sunil Bhattacharjya <
sunil_bhattacharjya at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Dear Anbuji,
> What about considering the Bhagavad Gita as the Guruvakya and Lord Krishna
> as the Guru.
> Vande Krishnam Jagadgurum
> Sunil K. Bhattacharjya
> --- On Wed, 2/3/10, Anbu sivam2 <anbesivam2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> From: Anbu sivam2 <anbesivam2 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] APerspective 17-2
> To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta" <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
> Date: Wednesday, February 3, 2010, 1:27 AM
>
> Sunilji,
>
> In addition to what I have said above, I think it is relevant to bring in
> the mutual superimposition (adhyaasa) that I have mentioned in my reply to
> Bhaskarji.
>
> The relation between the Aathman and the kosas is adhyaasa.  (If you want
> me
> to explain on this I will do that.)
>
> *This adhyaasa can be broken only by Guru Vaakya not by any self-analysis
> however correct it may be.*
>
> Perhaps these self-analysis and public discussion might induce one to
> surrender to a Guru.  That is the hope.
>
> *Surrender is the key to liberation.*
>
> Sri GurubyO Namaha.
>
> Regards,
>
> On Tue, Feb 2, 2010 at 7:32 PM, Anbu sivam2 <anbesivam2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Dear Sunilji,
> >
> > If there were no rays of the sun then the clouds cannot be formed so
> there
> > can be no identity for the cloud apart from the sun yet the clouds cover
> the
> > sun.  Likewise the smoke originates from the fire and therefore it cannot
> > have a different identity from the fire yet it covers the fire.  Likewise
> > all the kosas though spoken of as covering the aathman as sword and its
> > sheath, these kosas have no existence different and apart (such as the
> sword
> > and the sheath) from the aathman.
> >
> > Therefore the kosas are allegorical rather than material.
> >
> > We thus know of the manas and buddhi and chittha and ahamkara but cannot
> > point them out to anyone.
> >
> > So in waking state when the buddhi is alive the mind is under control of
> > the buddhi (unlike during dream time when the buddhi is absent) except
> under
> > the power of the vaasanaas the mind overpowers the buddhi during the
> waking
> > time.
> >
> > If everyone has no buddhi then how would the waking state be different
> from
> > the dream state?
> >
> > (I am aware that you and I talked of the existence or otherwise of the
> > buddhi in dream time before and we differed on this account.)
> >
> > Thus in waking time buddhi tries to rule while the manas, aided by the
> > vaasanaas, tries to overpower the buddhi.
> >
> > So when buddhi is predominant then you can say that the mind has sunk
> into
> > the buddhi ( in your parlance the manomaya kosa is sunk into vignanamaya
> > kosa).  When the sleep overtakes with both manas and buddhi absent then
> your
> > allusion that manomayakosa and vignanamaya kosa has sunk into aanandamaya
> > kosa can be a correct description.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Anbu
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Feb 2, 2010 at 7:57 AM, Sunil Bhattacharjya <
> > sunil_bhattacharjya at yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Dear Anbuji,
> >>
> >> Does not the Katha Upanisahad tell us that we have to still the  mind
> (or
> >> call it dissolve the Manomaya kosha) in the Jnanatmana (or the
> Vijnanamaya
> >> kosha or the Buddhi), which in turn is to be dissolved in Mahat (the
> >> Ananadamaya kosha)? Don't you think that Lord Yama knew his subject
> well?
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Sunil K. Bhattacharjya
> >>
> >> --- On Tue, 2/2/10, Anbu sivam2 <anbesivam2 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> From: Anbu sivam2 <anbesivam2 at gmail.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] APerspective 17-2
> >> To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta" <
> >> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
> >> Date: Tuesday, February 2, 2010, 3:09 AM
> >>
> >>
> >> Dear Sadanandaji,
> >>
> >> Your line of arguments have been quite logical.  I am not disagreeing.
> >>
> >> The mind is always there.  As Ramana says, one has to sink it into
> aathman
> >> for it to lose its virulence.  To use his own words, the mind then
> becomes
> >> a
> >> burnt rope that cannot tie.
> >>
> >> Many came to him, and very many out of them were non-intellectuals, even
> >> animals and birds, and they all easily attained Moksha and perhaps the
> >> world
> >> never even knew of them except a few.  However it were the giants of
> >> intellects including Ganapathi Muni who brought Ramana to light of the
> >> world.  But they all had so much of sankalpas and they were happy with
> >> their
> >> intellectual delights.  Ramana said that Naayana would be born again.
> >>
> >> How useless is the intellect!
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >> Anbesviam
> >>
> >> On Tue, Feb 2, 2010 at 5:44 AM, Anbu sivam2 <anbesivam2 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 6:11 AM, Kuntimaddi Sadananda <
> >> > ksadananda108 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 2:50 PM, Anbu sivam2 <anbesivam2 at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> > Dear Sadanandaji,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > PraNaams.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Quote: "Falsification is complete only when the underlying truth
> >> behind
> >> >> > both
> >> >> > knower and the known is recognized."
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Logically correct but practically never feasible for only one
> exists
> >> in
> >> >> > time
> >> >> > (or out of it) - not both!
> >> >> >
> >> >> > You need *TWO* to say that one is real and the other is false.  The
> >> >> > intellect will never apprehend the Reality, can it?
> >> >> >
> >> >> > shree Anbuji - PraNAms
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> What was discussed in the original post and the pervious ones as well
> >> is
> >> >> exactly what you have stated. I request the post be read again,
> perhaps
> >> >> again by those who are really want to know.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Mind (intellect) is needed to say that I am not the intellect. Hence
> >> the
> >> >> declaration quoted earlier..manaeva.manushyaanaam ..from amRitabindu
> >> Up.
> >> >> The
> >> >> all pervading reality need not have to realize and the inert
> intellect
> >> >> cannot realize. Realization is re-cognition that I am the existence
> >> >> consciousness that I am, currently identifying with the Intellect,
> >> >> understand that I am not the intellect, but that which is substantive
> >> of
> >> >> both the subject and the object vRittis or thoughts that arise in the
> >> >> intellect. This has to be done with the intellect only. With the
> >> intellect
> >> >> alone one can apprehend the truth. Hence the statement – tat
> >> vigijnaasasva
> >> >> or  brahma jignaasaa etc, where Brahman or atman has to be inquired,
> >> with
> >> >> the only available instrument - the intellect only.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Realization is to reject the superficial names and forms of the
> >> contents
> >> >> of
> >> >> the vRitti that arise in the intellect and shifting attention to the
> >> sat
> >> >> and
> >> >> chit that is substantive for both the subject and the object. This
> >> shift
> >> >> has
> >> >> to be by the intellect - that is what viveka means - nitya anitya
> vastu
> >> >> viveka - where intelligently shift ones attention for that which is
> >> >> permanent and eternal substantive truth from the superficial fleeting
> >> >> names
> >> >> and forms or attributive contents of the vRittis or thoughts.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> It is like I need the mirror and looking at the image in the mirror I
> >> >> recognize that I am not the image but the original because of which
> the
> >> >> image is there. without the mirror I cannot see my face. Using the
> >> iamge
> >> >> in
> >> >> the mirror I recognzie the orginal. Using the reflected consciousness
> >> in
> >> >> the
> >> >> intellect I recognize that I am the original consciousness. Using
> what?
> >> -
> >> >> The intellect only. That is what viveka means - original is eternal
> and
> >> >> permanent while the names and forms keep changing as attributive
> >> content
> >> >> of
> >> >> the vRittis. Intellect acts both as the mirror as well as instrument
> >> for
> >> >> re-cognition for realization that I am not instrument of cognition,
> >> i.e.
> >> >> intellect. This has been extensively discussed in the last and
> previous
> >> >> posts. This is the subtlest part and that is why chitta suddhi is
> >> >> important
> >> >> for me to detach myself from the attributive content of the vRittis
> to
> >> >> shift
> >> >> my attention to the ever present substantive. I have to use the
> >> intellect
> >> >> to
> >> >> say that I am not the intellect. This is also one of the reasons why
> I
> >> >> need
> >> >> a sampradaaya teacher for Vedanta to explain this subtlety correctly.
> >> >> Shraddhaa is the prerequisite. With this I remain.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Hope this helps
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> With praNAms to all
> >> >>
> >> >> Hari Om!
> >> >> Sadananda
> >> >> _______________________________________________
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