[Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna (wasRe:Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)

Sunil Bhattacharjya sunil_bhattacharjya at yahoo.com
Sat Oct 17 19:27:15 CDT 2009
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Dear friends,

What Ramana Maharshi said is in fact, the way of Tantra. Indulge in the act of the senses not for yourself (ie. not for selfish pleasure or in another word not as a seeker of pleasure in the senses) but for pleasing the gods, who represent the senses, to the extent or the way the gods desire. The aim is to please the senses as apart from oneself. Lord Krishna said the Bhagavad Gita about the need to please the gods and these, according to tantric interpretation, are the sense gods. Even in bhoga it is not for seeking pleasure for oneself. That way the Samadristi can come with the self- while being involved in the world of senses. This is a way alternative to Sannyasha, though difficult. Even a sannyashi may fail and such is the world of the senses. It is said that when Adi Sankaracharya did the Parakaya pravesh he assured his disciples that he would return  but later on he forgot to return. Luckily for him it was Padmapada , who had to refresh his
 memory to return to the Sannyasha. However Tantra is said to give fast results. Samayachara way of Tantra best suits a sannyashi.

Our scriptures have given all the different ways. There are the suktas of the Mother Goddesses. It is said that Gaudapadacharya's commentary on Nrsimhatapaniya was with Samayachara Tantra in mind. Even the Bandhas of the Hatha yoga are mentioned in Vedanta (See Varaha Upanishad). Kundalini is mentioned in Veda. Lord Krishna supplemented his Bhagavad Gita with the Uttara Gita, where he talks about Sushumna etc. thus treating the Kundalini yoga. We are fortunate to have all the ways to enable us to arrive at the truth, which is one.

Regards,

Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

--- On Sat, 10/17/09, D.V.N. Sarma <dvnsarma at gmail.com> wrote:

From: D.V.N. Sarma <dvnsarma at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna (wasRe:Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)
To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta" <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
Date: Saturday, October 17, 2009, 5:33 AM

Ramana Maharshi once talking with a devotee said
that he is so free that he can even marry and still
be free.

regards,
Sarma.

On 10/17/09, Vishy <vishy1962 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dear Sunilji
> I too agree that truth is one and was looked only from different angles.Only
> the means for achieving the ends differ. We, unfortunately stress too much
> on means ignoring the end itself.
>
> Jiddu always used to talk about the witness there within everyone. He
> advocated to drop the mind and seek within keeping aside all rituals. Even
> the thinking of UG Krihnamurthy (natural state) was quite advaitic, though
> it looks to be bit atheastic on the surface level. I consider these two as
> classic exapmles of Jnana yogis on the lines of Ashtawakra
>
> In that way, I feel, that is the crux of all upanishads and what shri
> Shankara said too.
>
> Hope you too might have come across the books of Swamy Rama Teertha (a great
> sage who dies at a ver early age of 31)   'In the woods of God realization'
> which are strongly advaitic with very practical approch.
>
> offthe the recent western teachers , I liked the books of Eckhart Tolle
> (Power of Now/ New Earth) which I feel is nothing but advaitic.
>
> Pranams
> Vishy
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On Sat, 17/10/09, Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya at yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> From: Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna
> (wasRe:Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)
> To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta"
> <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
> Date: Saturday, 17 October, 2009, 11:38 AM
>
>
> Vishyji,
>
> The truth is one. We the followers of the interpretive works of the great
> persons like Adi Sankaracharya and Gaudapadacharya understand it as Advaita.
> Everything is Brahman. How do you compare the works / thoughts of JK with
> those of Adi Sankaracharya?
>
> Sunil K. Bhattacharjya
>
> --- On Fri, 10/16/09, Vishy <vishy1962 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> From: Vishy <vishy1962 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna
> (wasRe:Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)
> To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta"
> <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
> Date: Friday, October 16, 2009, 10:13 PM
>
> Michealji
>
> Exactly, the persons I quoted remained detached but were teahing rather
> sharing their experiences, right! But they were not sanyasins in traditional
> way.
>
> Sanyasi is teh one who has completely dropped " I" (ego) along with all
> desires and attachements. This can be done bythe person  who has realized
> the truth. If you look in this way they were
>
>
>
>
>
> Vishy
>
> --- On Thu, 15/10/09, Michael Shepherd <michael at shepherd87.fsnet.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>
> From: Michael Shepherd <michael at shepherd87.fsnet.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna
> (wasRe:Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)
> To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta"
> <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
> Date: Thursday, 15 October, 2009, 3:47 PM
>
>
> Vishyji
>
> It's my understanding that a sannyasi may either renounce the world as a
> solitary, or having renounced the world, remain in it to teach the world.
> Would you agree?
>
> Michael
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: advaita-l-bounces at lists.advaita-vedanta.org
> [mailto:advaita-l-bounces at lists.advaita-vedanta.org]On Behalf Of Vishy
> Sent: 15 October 2009 05:42
> To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna
> (wasRe:Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)
>
>
>
> Michaelji
>
> can you accept UG Krishnamurthy or Jiddu krishnamurthy as Jnani and sanyasi
> considering their jnana and detached life style ?
>
> Pranams
> Vishy
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On Thu, 15/10/09, Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya at yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> From: Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna (wasRe:
> Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)
> To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta"
> <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
> Date: Thursday, 15 October, 2009, 5:06 AM
>
>
> Michaelji,
>
> Yes, the Jnani is a brahmin in the true sense of the term if you believe in
> the verse "Brahma janati iti brahman", even though by birth he may not be
> born in the brahmin's varna  and he has to discharge the duties of the
> non-brahmin varna he is born in
>
> Sunil.
>
> --- On Wed, 10/14/09, Michael Shepherd <michael at shepherd87.fsnet.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
> From: Michael Shepherd <michael at shepherd87.fsnet.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna (wasRe:
> Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)
> To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta"
> <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
> Date: Wednesday, October 14, 2009, 3:22 PM
>
> Sunil ji,
>
> Would it not  follow that the jnani would then fulfil the varna of brahmin ?
> And that, rather than being dependent on birth alone, varna is the duty in
> the whole society which one fulfils, at anhy one time, irrespective of birth
> ? That seems far nearer the divine intention than human 'rules'.
>
> Michael
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: advaita-l-bounces at lists.advaita-vedanta.org
> [mailto:advaita-l-bounces at lists.advaita-vedanta.org]On Behalf Of Sunil
> Bhattacharjya
> Sent: 14 October 2009 22:53
> To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna
> (wasRe: Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)
>
>
>
> Dear Vidyasankarji,
>
> I think what Bhaskarji says may appear to many to be a question like
> whrther  the egg came first or the chicken. But it need not be so. I shall
> give an example, only to convey the idea though one may find fault with the
> example. If one controls the breath, ie.does pranayama, then  the mind
> becomes calm and controlled. If one controls the mind by dhyana the breaths
> get controlled automatically.
>
> Simalarly a Jnani does niskama karma as he is a samadrasti and he realises
> everybody and everything is Brahman and he had overcome his self-interest.
> Now if one starts doing Niskama karma, say because one's guru advised one to
> do so or one wanted to follow the Bhagavad Gita without really realizing the
> merits of it, even then a time will come when he would automatically start
> doing Niskama karma, call it by force of habit if you like. Eventually he
> would realise the merit of doing the niskama karma and that he is no
> different from others and thus the Jnana will dawn on him.
>
> Regards,
>
> Sunil K. Bhattacharjya
>
>
> --- On Wed, 10/14/09, Vidyasankar Sundaresan <svidyasankar at hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> From: Vidyasankar Sundaresan <svidyasankar at hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Sankara on sannyAsa for Steadiness in GYAna (was
> Re: Jivanmukti - Jnana plus Sannyasa pt 5)
> To: "Advaita List" <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
> Date: Wednesday, October 14, 2009, 8:27 AM
>
>
>
>
>> But this jnAna is NOT the sole property of the
>> residents of saNyAsAshrama...Those who do not have the vedAdhikAra they
>
>
> Bhaskar, I have been following this debate to the best of my ability and
> time constraints, but can you point out to me one person/post where
> AtmajnAna is declared to be the sole property of the ASrama called sannyAsa?
>
>
>
>> too can attain the 'same' result by itihAsa purANa...but fact remains that
>> they have to have that Atma jnAna only nothing else and this jnAna does
>> not come from the purusha tantra 'karma' and this karma has to be elevated
>> to the status of karmaphala saNyAsa rUpa karma yOga to get jnAna nishTe.
>
>
> What do you mean by the above? jnAna does not come from karma, but karma
> yoga involving karmaphala sannyAsa = jnAna nishThA? How?
>
>
>
>>
>> Dear Karthik prabhuji, thanks for your reference from brahma sUtra...I
>> shall look at it when I go home today. And be rest assured I am going to
>> disprove NOT shankara but those who are declaring : WITHOUT EMBRACING
>> SANYAASA ASHRAMA THERE IS NO MUKTI WHATSOEVER :-))
>
>
> Again, don't you think you are breaking down a strawman here?
>
>
>
> Vidyasankar
>
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