[Advaita-l] creationist And evolutionist

[m w]

Dear Sylvanji, 
  you are going into the problem of actions and activity but it is also true as you said, that actions create lower prakriti for both feed on each other but the stand to take here is that discussed by Vishwanathanji, in which there is no action, no doer of action. All this is but the prakritic three fold activity going on and on, without actually anyone creating it, or if you want to call it creaing it then that's ok for it is another way of looking at the problem, but the stand of Brahmanic understanding is non-action, for action and further action make a vicious circle which binds, but if there is renunciation of all action (which of course points towards the wisdom or mental renunciation in deeper sense and not any external renunciation though it maybe the path for some and maybe helpful but in truth it has to end up in internal renunciation). 
   
  Once the understanding of non-action, pranic activity-mental activity and their interdependence, devotion, renunciation, Brahma AcharaN, any or all of these are understood to their depth, then there is no action, no doer and no creation..then even if whatever you do..it is non action, for you have renounced all the activity..if hands move, brain works..eyes see then all are doing their natural actions and there is no use to stop their natural functioning, for non action is proper functioning of all the natural components with dissolution of mind into truth consciousness..then there is no doing..That is what it actually means. I hope I am not being too vague here...
   
  Pranaams
  Manish
            

elisabeth-sylvain at sympatico.ca wrote:
  (Viswanathan) ... so where is the question of creator.

*
Do you mean our actions cannot create prakriti ?

Sylvan


>From: Viswanathan N 
>Reply-To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta 
>
>To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta 
>
>Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] creationist And evolutionist
>Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2006 05:57:29 +0100 (BST)
>
>What is that 'Self'? That is all pervading energy (Bhramhan). Its just one 
>without second, so where is need for any action from this. It remained, 
>remains and remain for ever, so where is the question of creator. The 
>physical / material world what we see is the result of Prakruthic/ 
>vyavaharic cycles waht you call otherwise the evolution. Its the result of 
>cause and result of very many actions under prakruthic dharma. It keps on 
>changing movement to movement which we call evolutionay process. But again 
>be sure, that self is neither involved nor has anything to do with this, it 
>remains just an observer of all these. When you center you conciousness to 
>this self, you wud be just the observer and not the doer or enjoyer.
>
>elisabeth-sylvain at sympatico.ca wrote:
>(Viswanathan) Evolution fits in better than creation for an advaitin.
>Creaton is more for more for prophrtic religions of west (islam,
>Chstny,Judaism) whis says creator sitting some where and created the world
>and adam /eve etc
>
>*
>
>However, I think advaitins recognize that our actions CREATE our world.
>Are we not the Self ... even if most of the times anaware ?
>
>Sylvan
>
> >From: Viswanathan N
> >Reply-To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta
> >
> >To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta
> >
> >Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] creationist And evolutionist
> >Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2006 09:34:51 +0100 (BST)
> >
> >Ya u r correct
> >
> > Evolution fits in better than creation for an advaitin. Creaton is more
> >for more for prophrtic religions of west (islam, Chstny,Judaism) whis 
>says
> >creator sitting some where and created the world and adam /eve etc.
> >
> >
> >Raghavendra N Kalyan wrote:
> > Namaste,
> >
> >
> > > Can an advaitin recognize creationism And (not or) evolutionism ?
> >
> >
> >Since evolution is based on pratyaksha and anumAna (direct
> >observation/experiment and logical inference), an advaitin should have no
> >problem in accepting it.
> >
> >
> >But creationism can create some problems. There are some creationists who
> >claim that the world was created in 4000 BC or something like that. These
> >are directly against observation and needless to say an advaitin would
> >reject them.
> >
> >
> >Of course there are some theories of creation in Sruti which "appear" to
> >contradict evolution. But then, the standard advaitic position is that 
>the
> >(mutually) contradictory nature of some creation theories in Sruti, is
> >meant to drive home the point that creation falls under the realms of 
>mAyA.
> >(I may not be exactly correct here, but this is the gist anyway). Note 
>that
> >this is not a modern day cooked-up reinterpretation of the Sruti but it 
>has
> >its basis in the mANDukya upanishad bhAshya + gauDapAda's kArikAs. The
> >"ajAti vAda" (no creation in the ultimate sense) is derived from this. 
>From
> >this point of view, neither Sruti nor advaita vedAnta (which is based on
> >Sruti) should have any problem with evolution.
> >
> >
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