Connection between Real and unreal (was Re: Non-reality of the world)

[Gummuluru Murthy]

On Wed, 15 Oct 1997, Ram Chandran wrote:


> ...                                                           .....
> question.  Whenever I try to explain REAL, I only elaborate how UNREAL I
> am!  All my explanations are just my own thoughts or the thoughts of
> others! Unfortunately there is no communication channel between the REAL
> and UNREAL!  There can never be any communication channel between REAL
> and UNREAL! When I experience REAL, I become SILENT and TOTAL PEACE and
> completely FREE!  I will have neither thoughts nor any IDENTITY!
> Brahman is THAT IT IS and not THIS IS IT!
>

Namaste.

Yes, certainly, there is no connection between the Real and the unreal.
Not even the vedas. Vedas also fall into the realm of maaya and hence are
not a connection between the Real and the unreal.

In the past few weeks, there is some mention of experiencing the Reality.
                                                ^^^^^^^^^^^^
Allan Curry quoted Puligandla's text where Puligandla stated that
experiencing the reality is unsublatable. Experience as pramAna was being
discussed in other threads. It was also mentioned by Shri Ram Chandran in
the referred paragraph above.

But, can the Reality be experienced by a human ? If human is in mithya and
                        ^^^^^^^^^^^
is a mithya, how can human experience Reality ? My feeling is, one cannot.
The most a human can do, in my view, is to recognize what is real and what
is unreal (not only intellectually but most importantly also in day to day
life). That alone would give a human eternal bliss. Such a person is
beyond the worldly attachments, and would not even be concerned whether
there is a re-birth or not. Because such a person has attained moksha here
itself. But, I do not think there is something called experience of Reality.
                                                      ^^^^^^^^^^
Would it not be conceptually simpler and easier to comprehend if we see
the Brahman Realization as the natural state and the human life as an
experience ? After all, experiences are short-term duration phenomenon
and may be wrong, whereas the jnana state is real and natural.


> ...                                                           .....
> question.  Whenever I try to explain REAL, I only elaborate how UNREAL I
> am!  All my explanations are just my own thoughts or the thoughts of
> others! Unfortunately there is no communication channel between the REAL


You are obviously referring to the body-mind-intellect when you say that
you are unreal. But you know that you are not the body-mind-intellect and
                        ^^^^
you know that you are the consciousness that is beyond the body-mind-intellect.
Then why do we need to say that we are unreal ?

I am sure we have all graduated from that we are the body with a mind and
intellect concept to thinking that we are not this body-mind-intellect. It
seems to me that we are putting ourselves in a trishanku swarga by saying
we are not this body-mind-intellect, but at the same time not admitting
that we are the consciousness that pervades all.

I admit that, as Shri Govind Rengarajan pointed out (in the thread ""I"-
self or the mind ?") that there is a danger of ego claiming the paramAtma
role. But, if we are sincere in saying that we are neither the body, the
mind, nor the discriminator but something beyond, then that danger is not
there. Further, there is more good to come out of such positive thinking
than the inherent dangers.

Regards
Gummuluru Murthy
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yadaa sarve pramucyante kaamaa ye'sya hr^di shritaah
atha martyo'mr^to bhavatyatra brahma samashnute   Katha Upanishhad II.3.14

When all the desires that dwell in the heart fall away, then the mortal
becomes immortal, and attains Brahman even here.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

>From  Mon Oct 20 11:20:54 1997
Message-Id: <MON.20.OCT.1997.112054.0400.>
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 11:20:54 -0400
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To: "Advaita (non-duality) with reverence" <ADVAITA-L at TAMU.EDU>
From: Ram Chandran <chandran at TIDALWAVE.NET>
Organization: Personal
Subject: Re: Connection between Real and unreal (was Re: Non-reality of
        the world)
Comments: To: Advaita List <advaita-l at tamu.edu>
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Gummuluru Murthy wrote:

> you know that you are the consciousness that is beyond the
> body-mind-intellect. Then why do we need to say that we are unreal ?

The person who experiences the TRUTH is REAL! The one who explains the
TRUTH is UNREAL!!