[Advaita-l] avidyA and mind in samAdhi

[Raghav Kumar Dwivedula]

Namaste Subbu ji
यस्य तु न एषोऽनुभवो द्रागिव जायते, तं प्रति अनुभवार्थ एव आवृत्त्यभ्युपगमः ।
तत्रापि न तत्त्वमसिवाक्यार्थात् प्रच्याव्य आवृत्तौ प्रवर्तयेत् ।  BSB 4.1.2
is an excellent reference you gave where the svarUpa of nididhyAsanam is
explained by bhAShyakAra.

(aspirants for whom such an anubhava has not occurred instantaneously, the
need for reiteration is required for generating that anubhava.)

My understanding -
During that AvRtti process, prior to the arising of anubhava-GYAnam, it
stands to reason that the avidyA bIja has not yet been destroyed
completely, although the akhaNDAkAra vRtti does arise (or at the very least
a 'conditional' version of it does arise in case we wish to preserve the
word "akhaNDAkAra vRtti" and define it as the last straw upon whose arising
the avidyA bIja becomes completely burnt).

  All this is very subtle and nuanced territory and the idea of "न
तत्त्वमसिवाक्यार्थात् प्रच्याव्य" (without deviating from the tattvamasi
vAkyArtha) is noteworthy as the characteristic of nididhyAsanam (and
samAdhi which in vedAnta, denotes uninterrupted continuity in the
akhaNDAkAra vRtti born of vAkyArtha alone) as per vedAnta.

Thank you Sudhanshu Ji for raising this topic

Om

Raghav









On Mon, 16 Oct, 2023, 12:24 pm V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l, <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 16, 2023 at 11:33 AM Sudhanshu Shekhar <
> sudhanshu.iitk at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Namaste V Subramanian ji.
> >
> > 1. Is there a difference between kAraNa sharIra and mUlAvidyA?
> >
>
> Namaste.
>
> They are the same.
>
> >
> > 2. If many sessions of nirvikalpaka samAdhi are needed for destruction of
> > mUlAvidyA, let us talk about the initial few sessions. If
> > tattva-agrahaNa-rUpA avidyA is not there, then how does it come back
> after
> > samAdhi? It is the basic seed. It cannot merge into something and come
> > back, like mind merges in avidyA in sushupti and comes back during waking
> > and dream.
> >
>
> Tattva agrahana rupa avidya is not there since the akhandAkAra vritti is
> accepted. This is AtmA/BrahmakAra vritti.In its presence 'I do not know the
> Self' kind of ignorance can't coexist. That is the purport of the
> Panchadashi verse and the commentary.
>
> >
> > 3. LeshAvidyA remains post jnAna is completely accepted. I was trying to
> > understand about other AkArAs of mUlAvidyA. If the causal seed is not
> there
> > in samAdhi, how will it come back!
> >
>
> The causal seed is not completely destroyed in the case of the need for
> more akhandAkAra vritti sessions. Such a situation is admitted by Shankara
> in the BSB 4.1.2:
>
> यस्य तु न एषोऽनुभवो द्रागिव जायते, तं प्रति अनुभवार्थ एव आवृत्त्यभ्युपगमः ।
> तत्रापि न तत्त्वमसिवाक्यार्थात् प्रच्याव्य आवृत्तौ प्रवर्तयेत् ।  For such
> of those aspirants such an experience has not occurred instantaneously, the
> need for reiteration is required for generating that experience...
>
> regards
> subbu
>
>
>
>
>
> >
> > Regards.
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 16, 2023 at 10:05 AM V Subrahmanian <
> v.subrahmanian at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Dear Sudhanshu ji,
> >>
> >> On this //Actually, it is saying, there is no "appearance" of sushupti
> >> (avidyA) in samAdhi and NOT "there is no sushupti (avidyA) in
> samAdhi".//
> >>
> >> We can see that the commentary, following the verses, is delineating on
> >> the vyaavrtti - anuvritti logic. It says: तेषु परस्परं
> >> व्यावर्त्यमानेष्वपि... this effectively is the 'absence' of the two of
> the
> >> three bodies in a given state. Therefore in Samadhi the kAraNa shrira,
> >> sleep, is not there.  But the Atman is there in all states.  As pointed
> out
> >> earlier, the tattva agrahana rUpa avidyA is not there in
> akhandakaravritti.
> >> That one will have to have many more such sessions in order to become a
> >> sthita prajna is not denied. That is another matter. By definition the
> >> samadhi as spoken of by Swami Vidyaranya in the cited verse is a
> situation
> >> where that basic avidya is not there.  That the lesha avidya that is
> >> required to bring him out of samadhi and continue in vyavahara, till
> death,
> >> is admitted and you have acknowledged that as well.
> >>
> >> regards
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 3:02 PM Sudhanshu Shekhar <
> >> sudhanshu.iitk at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Namaste V Subramanian ji,
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for the reply.
> >>>
> >>> I went through the Panchadashi shloka and the tIkA thereupon.
> >>>
> >>> //Here he says 'In Samadhi there is no Sushupti but Atman is present.
> >>> This is anvaya. The vyatireka is: when Atman is shining, sushupti is
> not
> >>> present. //
> >>>
> >>> Actually, it is saying, there is no "appearance" of sushupti (avidyA)
> in
> >>> samAdhi and NOT "there is no sushupti (avidyA) in samAdhi".
> >>>
> >>> The non-appearance of avidyA in samAdhi is well accepted. However, that
> >>> is explained not due to absence of avidyA, but due to absence of
> >>> avidyAkArA-avidyA-vritti. In avidyA-pratIti-vichAra of advaita-siddhi,
> MS
> >>> says:-
> >>>
> >>> न चैवं कदाचिदविद्याया अप्रतीत्यापत्तिः; इष्टापत्तेः, समाधौ
> तथाभ्युपगमात्
> >>> ।
> >>>
> >>> Is there any clear articulation anywhere that avidyA is not present
> >>> during samAdhi. Because if avidyA is not present during samAdhi, then
> one
> >>> will not be able to wake up from samAdhi.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> //Since it is admitted that the Tattva agrahana rupa avidya is present
> >>> in all three states, in Samadhi when Akhandakara vritti is there, that
> >>> avidya is not present. The Ramakrishna Teeka for the above verse where
> he
> >>> says 'ajnana is not there in samadhi', can be seen here:
> >>>
> >>> https://archive.org/details/panchadashi-ramkrishna/page/n57/mode/2up//
> >>>
> >>> Does attaining nirvikalpaka-samAdhi once leads to destruction of
> avidyA?
> >>>
> >>> //Of course, the mind, which is the instrument for even attaining
> >>> Samadhi, has to be admitted to be present. Also, the nascent form of
> >>> avidya/mind are admitted to be present even during samadhi, since they
> have
> >>> not destroyed so that the post-samadhi life of the Jnani requires this
> >>> non-binding form (lesha/vasana) of avidya is the one that sustains the
> >>> body-mind of the Jnani till the fall of the body.//
> >>>
> >>> This is well understood.
> >>>
> >>>
> >
> > --
> > Additional Commissioner of Income-tax,
> > Pune
> >
> > sudhanshushekhar.wordpress.com
> >
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